It's almost complete, we live in a military state.

[Potter]

LOL


I see your way past even trying to absorb other viewpoints, so guess theres no more i can say.

[Original Sin]

What Aspen's saying about the state of things at the moment is right. We're not in complete chaos, and America is still one of the best nations on the planet to live in in many aspects.

However, it's not the situation NOW that I'm afraid of. It's the choices we're making now, that are opening new doors for the powers that be. We're selling out our rights in the name of security, when in all reality, we are not in danger of outside threats. No more than we ever have been, and despite what we do, we will never be any safer. Shit happens...has happened, will happen again, regardless of how much we sacrifice.

What scares me are the people that are so quick to give up the things that make us Americans, all in the sake of security against a threat that is no more imminent or tangible than it ever has been before.
America, in theory, stands for freedom. So why are we selling out our freedoms? Why are we giving away the things that make us Americans, living in fear, and letting the 'terrorists' win? And beyond that, why are we letting a single narrow minded viewpoint dominate the people of an entire nation?

I honestly just don't see the threat of the military anymore, and I don't see how civilians carrying guns can protect us. But I'll submit that we just differ in opinion.

We may not win, but I'll take a fighting chance over complete submission any day. If the government knows that there will be oposition, they may rethink some of their options. If the populace is completely helpless, what's to stop them, especially when the executive branch is gaining more influence without the votes of congress.
That's the grand scale...but the civil issue is more prevelent. Since crime is not an uncommon thing, and the police seldom ever get there in time to stop violent crimes, I'd much rather be able to defend myself than not.

[Potter]

BUMP

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/artic ... E_ID=55925

More "detention camps" being built. even MORE fema executive orders being passed. Now the president officially has 100% dictatorship whenever he deems it a state of "national emergency"




"look at the flood of intellectuals who fled Germany before Hitler rose completely to power. They even tried warning their own families - but no one took notice until people started dying in front of them. People aren't going to take notice in what's happening in our country until stormtroopers start pulling their neighbors out into the streets and killing them. That's what it will take to have them notice."








"Its not just the paranoid part of me anymore. Now its the logical/self-preservation part. I know somethings going to happen. W just passed over 140 presidential directives having to do with FEMA and Homeland security granting him outrageous powers with no oversight. All of them having to do with "national emergencies". 1 + 1 = 2.

This is not a hard equation to figure out. "

[danc1005]

President Bush recently signed a little-reported National Security and Homeland Security Directive granting extraordinary powers to the president in the event of a declared national emergency, apparently without congressional approval or oversight.

This is scary...

EDIT: Scarily enough, I start to think that maybe Bush would cause an event similar to 9/11 and cover it up as if it were done by terrorists, just to excuse using such extreme measures. It could happen.

[Potter]

oh they've been passed before, and will be passed again and again. click page three, the first post on that page lists some of the ones passed a while ago. even just those are enough to let the president do whatever he wants.

[Original Sin]

EDIT: Scarily enough, I start to think that maybe Bush would cause an event similar to 9/11 and cover it up as if it were done by terrorists, just to excuse using such extreme measures. It could happen.

That's actually one of the theories behind 9/11 itself. When you look at a lot of the facts and details behind the event, a lot of them don't add up to the story that was reported by the press. Even a good number of the firefighters and emergency workers on the scene dispute what the government released as 'fact.'
One, that the airplanes hitting the towers could bring them down. Some videos of the towers falling actually show some of the floors being systematically blown out Before the towers started to fall.

I'm not saying I believe all the conspiracy theories, but they do exist, and some of them make damn good sense.

[danc1005]

Yeah, I've also seen some videos about the Pentagon, about it being a missile and not a plane according to eyewitness accounts...scary to think about.

EDIT: I can't wait for Aspen to get in here and start threatening us for openly discussing opposition to the government.

[malictus]

I don't seriously believe that there was a conspiracy behind the 9/11 attacks. For the most part, conspiracy theorists spend way too much time looking for something that usually isn't there.

There's plenty that our government is doing (openly) that we should be protesting, rather than spending our time looking for massive conspiracies that are highly unlikely at best...

[hascoolnickname]

youtube

[Original Sin]

I don't seriously believe that there was a conspiracy behind the 9/11 attacks. For the most part, conspiracy theorists spend way too much time looking for something that usually isn't there.

There's plenty that our government is doing (openly) that we should be protesting, rather than spending our time looking for massive conspiracies that are highly unlikely at best...

This is true, but I am also glad that people out there do think for themselves on these issues, even if for the most part, the majority never takes them seriously. Even if most of the theories turn out to be false, some of them aren't, and need to be brought to light somehow. If no one bothered looking into anything, that may never happen.
Whether you trust the government or not, it's been proven time and time again that people in power will often abuse it, and cover ups and scandals aren't uncommon in this country. Someone needs to be looking into that, even if it is some nut with too much time on their hands. As long as the public becomes aware of it in the end, and people stand up and take notice, I really don't care how the information gets out.

[hascoolnickname]

FUCK YEAH SEAKING!!!

(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)

[Spazz]

FUCK YEAH SEAKING!!!

(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)

*sigh* Wrong /b/board.

[hascoolnickname]

http://www.lewrockwell.com/suprynowicz/ ... icz66.html
google names to find events actually happened, article fails to provide citation

[built-to-spill]

Another thing to remember is that America has been through peaceful protests turning violent before. What is happening to the immigrants now resembles what people went through with the civil rights movement and protests of the vietnam war. Except now the national guard doesn't show up and kill people (4 dead in O-HI-O). And whatever garbage paranoia is going around these days, nothing is more frightening to me then being forced to take up a fight you don't want to take. When was the last time we had a draft?

With a country of 300 million people there's no way to ensure individual freedoms for all. Complaining will get you nowhere, especially when living in America illegally is still technically illegal. It's the governments own fault that immigration is such a huge issue, free citizenship anyone? I think it's coming, I would like to see more protests, but you can't expect a huge protest to not have bad incidents. I think this country is headed in a bad direction, but that's nothing new.

I am not scared of America becoming a police state.

It IS impossible to make 300 million people happy in perhaps the most culturally diverse and educated country on the planet.

[Potter]

put a frog in hot water, it jumps out. put a frog in cold water and slowly turn up the heat, it stays there.

It has been historically, statistically, and politically proven that each war brings us compromise - less freedoms. they have been slowly taken away and taken away. the average citizen barely notices, let alone bothers to care about it. we are blindly following, blindly believing and blindly walking through existence. go to school, have a family. die. the accepted normality - cares of outside forces one cannot necessarily feel at the time or acknowledge are non existent. people care about what they can see, feel, and acknowledge immediately. nobody is looking ahead, and when somebody does, ironically, it's about something minuscule and finite.


and about the draft, actually. it is still very active. it is still illegal not to register. Also, Presidential candidate John Edwards has stated he is very interested in re-instating the draft.



john edwards -

""What do you do if genocide breaks out? Those are things we have to be prepared for," Edwards said in the courtyard of a senior center in Claremont. "The president of the United States should prepare a strategic plan for containment of a civil war.""



preparation